Usar

[iamvff]

Hey Guys and Gals,

I just thought that I would open the rescue forum (it seemed empty and lonely) back up with a quick question to see where the topic goes. (and no bitchin at the _devil....he means well you know)

Anyways.....I just joined the Manitoba Urban search and Rescue Team. I went for a week of training in Nov. It was a blast. 24 people in our class. They now have approx. 70 trained. I understand that there is now 6 teams throughout Canada. Vancouver, Calgary, Brandon, Toronto, Montreal and Halifax. Is anyone on one of these teams and if there is.....comments?

be safe,
iamvff

[DoubleHelix]

Isn't it called HUSAR? Heavy Urban Search And Rescue? My captain at school is a HUSAR Instructor. Actually a bunch of my captains are. In Toronto that is.

[bestcoast]

I am thinking about putting my name in for consideration in the near future. The team info is found at www.can-tf1.org Cheers ...BC

[DoubleHelix]

Cool I wonder why in toronto its called HUSAR

[iamvff]

There seems to be little info available on Usar or Husar. My understanding is that HUSAR is Heavy Urban Search & Rescue, USAR is just Urban Search & Rescue. I am to new to this to know if there is a difference. But I don't think so. In the web site listed...can-tf1 stands for Canada task force one. this is based out of Vancouver and is TF1 because it was the first group to be formed in Canada.

Be safe,
iamvff

[firecadet911]

Hey guys,

Just thought I could add a couple quick facts to this post. There is also a task force 2 located in Calgary. I heard somewhere at the academy that the difference between USAR and HUSAR is that a HUSAR team has a crane or similar equipment. Don't know if that's true or not, but just what I heard.

[FireEMTGuy]

HUSAR, I believe, is typically geared towards collapse type rescues (WTC etc), as stated with cranes etc, and not so much geared towards finding missing people here and there.

USAR and SAR are geared towards finding missing people whether it be urban or rural, just a slight difference in tactics.

I have my SAR course and it was a great course. It was taught by the Edmonton Police Services' USAR corrdinator.

SAR is geared more towards heavy rural situations whether it be a farmers feild or deep in the rockies. USAR is geared towards urban settings such as malls, parks, buildings, etc. Tactics and strategy.

Feel free to correct me if I am wrong! (as my definition of usar may be completly wrong...) :)

[iamvff]

I think you are basically correct. USAR is geared toward live victim recovery in building collapse type situations. We may however be tasked with deceased recovery if required. But for the most part so far we are trained to get inthere and get live people out. The week long course we just took in Nov. was pretty much all geared towards shoring, repelling, victim recovery, universal codes, patient packaging. Ground search and rescue is more for the lost or missing people in outside or rural settings. We were told that our obligation was to Manitoba first, and then possibly national if required, although I am sure that it would not be us as we are the youngest team in the system. Realistically our calls would probably be something like an arena collapse do to snow weight, or a mall or something. Although terrorism always comes up in conversation now. We use the INSARAG marking system which is recognized and used throughout the world. Intersting to note the USA is the only country that uses a different marking system for their USAR application. They use the FEMA system. We have another meeting on Jan 7/8. We will be discussing how we will be deployed, etc. I think this meeting will shed a lot of light on what we will actually be involved with and what our expectations will be. It is a very diverse group of people we have. Volunteer fire, ambulance, RCMP, hydro, dog teams, ofc, etc.

Be safe,
iamvff

[BillyBlazes]

I am a member of Toronto's HUSAR team whcih is made up of police, fire, medics and city engineers.

We are HUSAR Task Force 3, Vancouver is Task Force 1 and Calgary is Task Force 2.

Toronto's team started training at our Special Operations Academy this year. There is a lot of new things to learn.

The equipment cache that the team has is incredible.

[iamvff]

I have noticed that Toronto is called HUSAR, what is the difference between HUSAR and USAR? Is it the heavy equipment? How long have you been involved? Have you been deployed yet for anything? Information is very limited on these groups, fill me in. It is expected that we will be TF4, but that has not been determined yet, I don't think

Be safe,
iamvff

[Hart]

The book I have list three types of usar the first one being light then medium and heavy. Each one has a list of different equipment and training along with performance requirements that you must have. The book is called Canadian Urban Search and Rescue ClassificationGuide this was a draft copy on March 2004. If you want a copy check with public safety and emergency preparedness canada

Hart

[bestcoast]

Typical Canadian Government red tape BS. Vancouver's USAR team was ready to go again and was told to stand down. What happened in SE Asia is similar to what they are predicting for the west coast someday. Not only could the team have helped out with all their unique skill's they could have gained valuble experience.:mad: :mad:

[wilderness]

go shovel some snow will yea oh give me your address i will UPS you a parcel... NO I AGREE a friend of mine is with the DARTS he's a combat engineer, why not send both teams, your going to be working together if something ever happens here in Canada, get the bugs worked out now instead of later...

[Red_Devil]

USAR is strickly a volunteer group, im not sure if there are even a public or private group, they recieve funding throught the government although not that much.

HUSAR is a tactical team, that is sponsored by the provincial and maybe federal govt. It is comprised of fulltime firefighters who follow a specific training program and are trained to certain standards.

Basically if there is a major incident that requires such team the HUSAR team would be called in, such as the theatre incident in toronto a few years back where the theatre being demoed fell unto an adjacent building, HUSAR was called in. I think USAR would be called in to perform volunteer work once HUSAR was in control of the scene.

[bestcoast]

Originally posted by Red_Devil
USAR is strickly a volunteer group, im not sure if there are even a public or private group, they recieve funding throught the government although not that much.

HUSAR is a tactical team, that is sponsored by the provincial and maybe federal govt. It is comprised of fulltime firefighters who follow a specific training program and are trained to certain standards.

Basically if there is a major incident that requires such team the HUSAR team would be called in, such as the theatre incident in toronto a few years back where the theatre being demoed fell unto an adjacent building, HUSAR was called in. I think USAR would be called in to perform volunteer work once HUSAR was in control of the scene.

Vancouver's USAR team is the first of it's kind in Canada. They are not a volunteer group they are Firefighter's, police, paramedic's, city engineer's etc...and are sponsored by all 3 level's of government. The team's that have followed, Calgary, Toronto, etc received some of their training from Vancouver's team . the website is once again www.can-tf1.org for more info. ....BC

[Fireknight]

They keep talking about a HUSAR team here, for Ottawa but they say Toronto's is close enough by to be activated to come to Ottawa, nice to know that the nations capital is so well protected,as long as the 401 does not have a traffic jam...:rolleyes:

[bestcoast]

FK, sound's like your classic case of " Risk Management" doesn't it...:rolleyes: ....

[iamvff]

HUH...finally something I actually know a little bit about (no really)

I just got back from my second USAR training exercise in Brandon,(like, a half hour ago) and I specifically asked the question of the difference between USAR and HUSAR. I was quite surprised at the answer.....
There is no difference! Years ago when this all first started being talked about they developed 3 types of teams (as hart posted), light, medium, and heavy.

Light- would be teams like Regina and Saskatoon, that are capable of doing search and rescue in light residential type of buildings.

Medium-would be able to deal with the stuff that is a little to difficult for the light duty. they would have more equipment and more capabilities to get the job done.

Heavy- would be the guys that come in when no one else can handle things, such as large or difficult search and rescues. They would also have access to much heavier equipment, like cranes, jack hammers, listening devices, etc.
(Don't quote me on these definitions, I am going by memory, and it aint great. but you get the gest of it)

Toronto took on the HUSAR name, but now the organizations are finding that there really isn't much difference or requirement to have both medium and heavy teams, so they are only going to have only light and heavy, and the heavy teams will be dropping the "H". and will now be called USAR.

Now, with that being said, The 6 USAR teams that are and are to be developed in Canada are Vancouver (TF#1), Calgary(TF#2), Manitoba (probably going to be TF#4), Toronto(TF#3), Montreal and Halifax (both still on the drawing board). My understanding is that Van., Cal, and T.O. all consist of volunteers from many different aspects of emergency services. the Manitoba team consist of many volunteers from all trades. We have carenters, hydro employees, police, fire, ambulance, engineers, etc. The teams are all sponsored on both the provincial and federal levels.

This is kind of a nutshell explanation, because my head is still spinning from all of the info this weekend, but if you have a question, or I didn't explain something right just ask.

Be safe
iamvff

[bestcoast]

Just listening on the new's and heard our USAR has been called out and way to close to home. Unfortunately an embankment in North Vancouver couldn't handle the down pour we have had lately and slide away taking two houses with it. One person in serious condition and one missing at last report......brutal stuff we are getting slides everywhere 250mm rain will do that:mad:

[scoop422]

Stay safe!

[iamvff]

BC...Clip any new coverage from the paper if you have time. I would love to read about it. Let me know if you come across anything.

Thanks,
iamvff

[bestcoast]

Originally posted by iamvff
BC...Clip any new coverage from the paper if you have time. I would love to read about it. Let me know if you come across anything.

Thanks,
iamvff

Will do.....probably be lot's in tomorrow's paper and i'm sure the boss will post a couple under the headlines....BC...

[bestcoast]

iamvff this is more specific.........


www.iaff18.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=news.drilldown&newsid=607

[iamvff]

Thanks a ton. Anymore..let me know.

I owe ya one.

be safe,
iamvff;)

[bestcoast]

Anytime Brother............BC......

[Bluenoser]

Halifax ( you know, "let them freeze in the dark") is currently in the process of getting a deployable USAR team up and running. The process (2-3 years) is agony, dealing with the Feds and their Prov. counterparts.
Montreal was supposed to be Can. TF4 however they have bailed from the process. I suppose that leaves us little old Bluenosers to be Can.TF4.

Be strong and of good courage!

[iamvff]

I Finally got my call from the OFC, I am on the Manitoba USAR team for sure!(I think...you know politics...nothings for sure) I got called the other day to go to the training scenario in Calgary in May, and also will be getting my letter today or tomorrow to go and pick up all of my clothing that they buy for team members. They said welcome to the team...so it must be true :D Being an underdog for getting accepted, I am quite please I got the call, now I can go to Calgary and bust my nuts and prove that they made the right decision :cool:

Be safe
iamvff

[dentedhead]

Nice one MFM!

Dentedhead

[skidder]

does anyoneknow of any usar training coming up still open for application..... my buddy just got kicked from the brandon course after being accepted months ago..... who knows what happened... if anyone could PM or post here please let me know.

thanks guys!

[iamvff]

does anyoneknow of any usar training coming up still open for application..... my buddy just got kicked from the brandon course after being accepted months ago..... who knows what happened... if anyone could PM or post here please let me know.

thanks guys!

I have never heard of anyone being "kicked" from the course?? Explain what you mean, and how he knows that?? There is a course being offered in a week or so at the MESC, structural collapse level1, but it will be full I am sure. Other than that, you have to apply to be on USAR, and get accepted to participate in the training. Only the people picked can take the training. Talk to Scott Kerbis at the OFC in Brandon. But if the rumors I heard are correct, last Sept. they had a ton of applicant(remember..just rumor)I think they want to have about 120 trained, they usually take 60 on an away course. I am pretty sure that after this course in a week or so, they will be at about 100-110 trained in structural collapse level 1.

be safe
iamvff

[skidder]

That would be the course he was listed for.
Had his confirmation letter a few months ago... has everything else but this course to finish to be on the USAR team. He recieved a letter last week stating that he was no longer able to attend the MESC course. When he called scott and a few other instructors they wouldn't tell him anything.

I don't know if they maybe over booked by mistake and kicked a volly instead of a full time guy. I'm not pointing any fingers, just left guessing.

[iamvff]

That would be the course he was listed for.
Had his confirmation letter a few months ago... has everything else but this course to finish to be on the USAR team. He recieved a letter last week stating that he was no longer able to attend the MESC course. When he called scott and a few other instructors they wouldn't tell him anything.

I don't know if they maybe over booked by mistake and kicked a volly instead of a full time guy. I'm not pointing any fingers, just left guessing.

I have not heard of this happening?? I am a volly, so I don't think that it's an issue! But I did notice that now they have me representing my mutual aid district (I applied on my own), so maybe they are alotting only so many per mutual aid district?? PM me and let me know where you are??

iamvff

[skidder]

you know it very well might be that.... I have no idea. Just told him i would try and find him a course somewhere else. Sorry if it sounded like i was pointing fingers at anyone... didn't mean to.

[iamvff]

I Finally got my call from the OFC, I am on the Manitoba USAR team for sure!(I think...you know politics...nothings for sure) I got called the other day to go to the training scenario in Calgary in May, and also will be getting my letter today or tomorrow to go and pick up all of my clothing that they buy for team members. They said welcome to the team...so it must be true :D Being an underdog for getting accepted, I am quite please I got the call, now I can go to Calgary and bust my nuts and prove that they made the right decision :cool:

Be safe
iamvff
Yeah...so much for that idea..apparently the Fed's pulled the funding and Calgary was cancelled!! Damn, I was quite geared up for it to! :mad:

iamvff

[DFCSmash]

Yeah...so much for that idea..apparently the Fed's pulled the funding and Calgary was cancelled!! Damn, I was quite geared up for it to! :mad:

iamvff

Well that bites don't it.

But the good news is twofold.

Firstly the federal gov't. KNOWS that there will be no catyclismic events anywhere in this country which would require USAR skills and capabilities.

Secondly, the federal gov't. will now have more funding available for those struggling advertising agencies in Quebec, who have been vastly under-utilized over the past, say, 18 months.

[iamvff]

Yahoo....Calgary is back on and I am going!! End of October we head to Calgary's USAR Training centre and do a 1 day exercise! Can't wait, should be a blast, and yet another new experience!

iamvff

[bestcoast]

Just watching the news and Vancouver's USAR team is getting a police escort to the airport to board a charter to the New Orleans area to assist in the releif effort. Be safe boys.............BC.........

[iamvff]

We were told a while back that it would be improbable that we would ever go to the States, as they have so many USAR teams of their own throughout...but I have been listening and watching with interest....just in case! You never know!

iamvff

[dentedhead]

I have noticed that Toronto is called HUSAR, what is the difference between HUSAR and USAR? Is it the heavy equipment? How long have you been involved? Have you been deployed yet for anything? Information is very limited on these groups, fill me in. It is expected that we will be TF4, but that has not been determined yet, I don't think

Be safe,
iamvff

The H just stands for Heavy.

Dentedhead

[bestcoast]

An update......

www.citytv.com/vancouver/news_15464.aspx

www.vancouver.ca/usar/

[FireChef]

I just read a forum thing saying that Vancouver's USAR is the first International (outside of the states) to be called for help in New Orleans.




Take Care Boys (Ladies)

[bestcoast]

Sounds like the guys are finally able to start doing what they do best!!

www.vancouver.ca/usar/ ....BC..........

[FireChef]

I know it doesnt really have to do with Fire, but a good friend of mine with BCAS and about 12 other guys went to New Orleans today to help out down there.





Take Care guys, and be safe!!!

[Firefighter1680]

They wont let the WInnipeg guys be on the team, or rather I should say the administration wont let our guys have paid leave to go.. SOme Political BS about who shoudl run the team etc etc..

[DFCSmash]

Ah the dreaded OFC vs, WFPS p***ing contest strikes again. Screw what's good for the people, doesn't matter, it's all about who should be in charge!

I hear ya 1680, it's a sad commentary isn't it?

[Firefighter1680]

Yeah I asked the Chief about it and our chief feels Winnipeg should be in charge with it having most of the FF, Medics, Docs etc coming from the city... I got no where...lol

[Toxic]

You know if ever the OFC and WFPS started acting like adults and worked together Manitoba would be one awesome place to train to be a firefighter. The guys in Winnipeg have the experience and the guys in Brandon know the thoery.

I'm kind of stuck in the middle in some ways. I have been a volly for a decade and all my training has been with the OFC. My normal job has me in contact with WFPS on our larger hazmat incidents and previously I've worked with volly's and WFPS on hazmat incidents with my last employer.

If you talk to WFPS about the OFC or vise versa you can feel the tension start to build. Can't we all just get along???

[Firefighter1680]

I hear ya... To say that we have the experience and they know theory is not toally accurate. I do believe we have alot of very booksmart/experienced firefighters, a good combo of both.
The argument is that if you look at Vancouver,task force 1 , they are all fulltime firefighters, doctors, medics, police, engineers. The admins argument is that we do this everyday so they should give the team to winnipeg to run and co-ordinate. I agree in that regard, but would never get into the discussion about fulltime vs volly, would never go there.

The part that I have alawys found intetresting, being a brandon grad, most of the instructors have never been fulltime firefighters or medics. Take the USAR training, how many of the instructors have some type of field experience? Did they just take the course then become an instructor? My instructors for fire, had never been in a "real" fire so I found out after..You need the book smarts and experience, and when the shit hits the fan, your real life training will save you. I have been in som very very sticky situations and it was experience of a senior guy who taught me hwo to deal that made the diff. Food for thought. not trying to stir anything up..

[Toxic]

Agreed 1680. My statement was a little too much of a blanket. Some of the OFC guys have some level of experience and WFPS do have good instuctors at the academy. My bad for not qualifying that statement.

Our volly chief is a long time career firefighter with Wpg. I like doing training with him because he will tell us that this is how you're supposed to do it but this is how we do it in Winnipeg. From there he kind of lets you decide for yourself what is going to work. Yes some bad habits come through sometimes but it's not bad to moderate that with what we originally learned from the OFC "theory" instuctors. I figure if I land somewhere in he middle I'll be alright.

You hit the nail on the head with instuctors taking the course and then teaching it though. I got into a situation a few years back co-instructing a hazmat ops course with one of the OFC instuctors. He thought the world revolved around the college's "hazmat team" and I argued that other agencies would be likely be on scene first. Once again real life vs theory (mixed with a little college politicals).

[iamvff]

The argument is that if you look at Vancouver,task force 1 , they are all fulltime firefighters, doctors, medics, police, engineers. The admins argument is that we do this everyday so they should give the team to winnipeg to run and co-ordinate.

The Manitoba USAR is intentionally not based on career people from emergency services. It is instead chocked full of people from almost every trade imaginable. Everyone who is on the team has their resume stored on file, so that if a specialty is required in a situation they can go to the data base and figure out who to get in touch with. We have people with just about every trade and technical background imaginable, and as well as Vancouver, we also have doctors, engineers and police! The added bonus to all of the great people we have on our team, is that we all have a background in emergency services as well, and if we get called out, we don't deplete the primary cache of career emergency service members in one specific area. I really can't see them needing to just hand it over to Winnipeg firefighters to be a viable team, but if you want to apply and be a part of our team...we'd love to have you!!

have agreat day!
iamvff

[ABFF37]

hey iamvff,
not to change the topic, but are you still coming to Calgary for that USAR course (AKA HUSAR course LOL) at the end of October? We should go for beers :D

AB

[iamvff]

hey iamvff,
not to change the topic, but are you still coming to Calgary for that USAR course (AKA HUSAR course LOL) at the end of October? We should go for beers :D

AB
Yes, I will be there for sure, but I don't think there will be much time for anything else, as we get there...do our thing...and head straight home! BUT...If I can find time...I have yet to turn down beer!! On the other hand I am occasionally out there as my sister lives in Calgary, so you never know!

iamvff

[ABFF37]

Yes, I will be there for sure, but I don't think there will be much time for anything else, as we get there...do our thing...and head straight home! BUT...If I can find time...I have yet to turn down beer!! On the other hand I am occasionally out there as my sister lives in Calgary, so you never know!

iamvff

Sure thing...keep me posted, the offer is on the table! :)

AB

[K9kazoo]

Date: Tue Sep 6 13:51:37 2005
Subject: City of Calgary Responds to Hurricane Katrina
From: Bonnie Tucker

-----BEGIN MD5 -----------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------------
CITYBEAT - CITY OF CALGARY PRESS RELEASE
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Calgary - Calgary Mayor Dave Bronconnier extended Calgary’s
sympathy to the citizens of Louisiana and Mississippi today
during a media conference where he outlined how The City’s
could support the response to Hurricane Katrina.

“For most of the last week The City has been working with our
provincial and federal emergency management partners to
identify how Calgary can help our American friends and
neighbours,” says Bronconnier. “We have expertise and
resources that may be required, but we also respect that
requests for help need to come directly from the US to our
federal government, who can then contact us.” Bronconnier
indicated that Calgary’s offers have been relayed directly to
the office of Deputy Prime Minister Anne McLellan, Minister
of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness.

Bronconnier noted that Calgary’s 70-member Urban Search and
Rescue team (USAR) is the backup to Vancouver’s USAR, which
has already been deployed to Louisiana. “Last Thursday we
offered this unit, which is the very best at what it does,”
says Bronconnier. “Then on Friday, through a conversation
between the EMS Chiefs of Canada, Calgary offered 15
paramedics for a Canadian response team.” He noted that The
City will continue to work with provincial and federal
authorities to provide resources as needed.

Citing the need to respect the massive disaster response
coordination effort required, Bronconnier said that Calgary’s
offers for support will remain in place indefinitely. “This
isn’t an overnight response,” he said. “We’ve been on alert
and are ready to support when needed. But with the situation
changing almost by the minute we also recognize that this
will be a long-term relief effort.”

Major Bronconnier encourages Calgarians who seek to support
the relief effort to contact the local chapter of the
Canadian Red Cross. “We appreciate the graciousness of
Calgarians,” says Michael Louie, Disaster Services
Coordinator for the Southern Alberta Region of the Red Cross.
“For those interested in helping, financial contributions
allow us the most flexibility to support those in need.”

Speaking on behalf of the United States was Mr. Naim Ahmed,
US Consul General in Calgary. “We appreciate and applaud the
tremendous generosity of The City’s offer,” says Ahmed. “It
underscores the close friendship this City shares with the
United States.”

[Wulfey]

They wont let the WInnipeg guys be on the team, or rather I should say the administration wont let our guys have paid leave to go.. SOme Political BS about who shoudl run the team etc etc..

Paid time off!! Wow. Take holidays. That's what alot of the rest of us have to do. When we were put on standby for the hurricane, I was looking at using up all of my holiday time for the deployment. Of course if you don't have support from above, I guess it would be hard to get time off on short notice.

It's gonna be a long bus ride from Brandon to Calgary, without WFPS, who's gonna bring the strippers?

KIDDING! It's a joke, laugh. haha. sorry (back me up guys) heh

[iamvff]

Paid time off!! Wow. Take holidays. That's what alot of the rest of us have to do. When we were put on standby for the hurricane, I was looking at using up all of my holiday time for the deployment. Of course if you don't have support from above, I guess it would be hard to get time off on short notice.

It's gonna be a long bus ride from Brandon to Calgary, without WFPS, who's gonna bring the strippers?

KIDDING! It's a joke, laugh. haha. sorry (back me up guys) heh

Hey wolfey, I am guessing you are on the USAR team in MB?? Where are you from? Are you doing level 2 at the end of the month?

iamvff

[Firefighter1680]

Your employer should be giving you time off. Firefighting is my fulltime job and usar would be a speciality. If our Hazmat is called somewhere, they get paid to be there. Task force 1 - Vancouver is paid to be there, dont kid yourself.

If your employers cant see the benefit in the service you are providing, thats too bad. That was another problem with the team, if they arent fulltime personel, who pays your leave? do you get funding from the government? All that is covered on any of the other teams in Canada, I know guys on TF-1 and dont let anyone tell you that they arent covered when they go. Why should the plp who are going to help have to worry about their bills and getting paid? What if you didnt have holidays? do you not go? Sounds like alot of thought by the OFC...again..

Post 1? - Good way to introduce yourself to the group, you make friends well..

[Wulfey]

Your employer should be giving you time off. Firefighting is my fulltime job and usar would be a speciality. If our Hazmat is called somewhere, they get paid to be there. Task force 1 - Vancouver is paid to be there, dont kid yourself.

If your employers cant see the benefit in the service you are providing, thats too bad. That was another problem with the team, if they arent fulltime personel, who pays your leave? do you get funding from the government? All that is covered on any of the other teams in Canada, I know guys on TF-1 and dont let anyone tell you that they arent covered when they go. Why should the plp who are going to help have to worry about their bills and getting paid? What if you didnt have holidays? do you not go? Sounds like alot of thought by the OFC...again..

Post 1? - Good way to introduce yourself to the group, you make friends well..

Well well, obviously touchy. I'm sure some people took the joke. I'm not going to pussy foot around an issue just to be Politically Correct for my first post! Sorry.

When I joined the USAR team, it was a choice, and I made a commitment, knowing full well I would have to sacrifice some things (holidays, time with family, etc.). You see, as a volunteer on the USAR team, I still remember that this stuff is about the victims/patients/casualties, not about me. If I don't have enough holiday time for a deployment, I don't go. Simple. The OFC has intentionally made the USAR team from a great number of people so if I can't go, someone else can.
I sacrifice stuff to help others in need, that's what it's about. I've done that since I started Fire and EMS.

If Winnipeg can't make and run (and deploy) a team because of political BS, but the OFC can, why does it matter who can run it better. The OFC picked up the ball and ran with it. They have an awesome pool of people who would like to help out (and think it is a privledge). I bet you iamvff knows what I'm talking about. (by the way, yep, I'll be at the Level 2, and I have to take time off for it!!!)

I'm not knocking Winnipeg, so chill, you are way too uptight. They can't get their ducks in a row and therefore don't have a USAR team. The OFC can. So try not to knock the OFC. I just wish there was a way we could get some of the guys from Winnipeg on the USAR team.

Sacrifice will get you further than attitude.

Relax.

[iamvff]

Your employer should be giving you time off. Firefighting is my fulltime job and usar would be a speciality. If our Hazmat is called somewhere, they get paid to be there. Task force 1 - Vancouver is paid to be there, dont kid yourself.

If your employers cant see the benefit in the service you are providing, thats too bad. That was another problem with the team, if they arent fulltime personel, who pays your leave? do you get funding from the government? All that is covered on any of the other teams in Canada, I know guys on TF-1 and dont let anyone tell you that they arent covered when they go. Why should the plp who are going to help have to worry about their bills and getting paid? What if you didnt have holidays? do you not go? Sounds like alot of thought by the OFC...again..

Post 1? - Good way to introduce yourself to the group, you make friends well..

I not only don't get paid, I am the sole employee at my own business. I close the door while I am away! Do I want sympathy...nope, that is a choice I made together with my family, to do something I love to do. Some people pay tens of thousands of dollars to get a university or college education, I just consider myself to be a late bloomer, and when these types of things cost a penny from my pocket, I chalk it up to being my tuition fees for something I hope to make a career out of down the road(although, I am not quite sure what the career will be). On the other hand, we have people on our team from hydro, RCMP, etc that get paid when they are involved with the team, and I say...all the best to them!! I wish I did as well...but I don't and I still want to be a part so...oh well! For the record...we get paid for calls we get outside of the province, but volunteer for calls inside of the province, and we new that going into it!!

BTW..wulfey...I agree with your post completely. It is exactly how I feel! PM me when you have time...we'll visit!

iamvff

[Wulfey]

Amen, bro.

I'm new to this, so I'll PM you next week.
Right now I'm going down to 1680's neck of the woods for a football game.

It's not about us.

[tmehmel]

Amen, bro.

I'm new to this, so I'll PM you next week.
Right now I'm going down to 1680's neck of the woods for a football game.

It's not about us.

See you at the game, I will wave!!!

Tom

[Firefighter1680]

When I joined the USAR team, it was a choice, and I made a commitment, knowing full well I would have to sacrifice some things (holidays, time with family, etc.). You see, as a volunteer on the USAR team, I still remember that this stuff is about the victims/patients/casualties, not about me.

Sacrifice will get you further than attitude.
[/QUOTE]

Im not one to go down this road but, its a bold statement to make that as a "Volunteer" you remember what this is about.
Volunteer FF's would tell you that they would make the best team, and so would fulltimers. If you read my post I said I wasnt one to get into that debate. I was a volunteer for 5 years, and fulltime for 8. Funny how volunteers "sacrifice" and I have attitude beacuse I get paid?

Before you spoout off inquire as how the team was started. Its not that WPG couldnt start a team. There was federal funding provided to the province. The politacl BS is the constant fight between OFC and Winnipeg to see who is the bigger dog on the block. I have been to fire college, and they are experts, yet no one has done any of what they teach as a profession. All book knowledge, and now ill teach it. The agreument, if you read my orginal post, is that WFPS does it everyday fulltime. OFC did not want to let WFPS run the team and the pissing match back and forth is who is more qualified..

I had not any opinion as to who should run it simply that we are not eligible to be on the team beacuse we cannot get time to go. If you ask Scott, this is the case. When I applied I was told there was no agreement and we are not allowed to be on the team.

[Wulfey]

I think you are getting off course here. You seem to escalate things and assume well, so I will try to set some things straight.
Im not one to go down this road but, its a bold statement to make that as a "Volunteer" you remember what this is about.
Volunteer FF's would tell you that they would make the best team, and so would fulltimers.
I don't remember stating I was a volunteer FF, I remember posting I was a volunteer on the USAR team. I'd say you are just itching to go down that road, but I'd be assuming. I think both make good teams and have pros and cons. Don't put words in my mouth.
Funny how volunteers "sacrifice" and I have attitude beacuse I get paid?
No, again, I was willing to sacrific to be on the team, you stated you couldn't be on the team because you "couldn't get PAID time off". You are escalating this beyond what it was meant to be. It seems you want conflict. As for the attitude part, read this...
Your employer should be giving you time off... dont kid yourself... If your employers cant see the benefit in the service you are providing, thats too bad... Sounds like alot of thought by the OFC...again... Post 1? - Good way to introduce yourself to the group, you make friends well... Before you spoout off...
etc. etc. ahhh the attitude. That's why I think you have attitude, it had nothing to do with you being paid. Quit putting words in my mouth.
If your employers cant see the benefit in the service you are providing, thats too bad.
Really!! Looks like I am on the team, and YOUR employer can't see the benefit in the service you could (but are not) supplying.
I have been to fire college, and they are experts, yet no one has done any of what they teach as a profession. All book knowledge, and now ill teach it.
Woah, that's quite the broad generalization that would piss a whole lot of well qualified people from the OFC off, I would take that back. You see what I mean about attitude. Talk about burning bridges!
The agreument, if you read my orginal post, is that WFPS does it everyday fulltime.
Does what, USAR? So you have carpenters that build shoring everyday? You do Ground Search and Rescue everyday? You have Engineering Technologists that have years of experience with specialized search equipment that use it every day? You have guys that move multi-ton blocks of concrete by hand every day? They practice being self sufficient for weeks at a time, you guessed it, every day? Yeah, sounds like "WFPS does it everyday fulltime".
Read my original post, you escalated this WAY beyond what it was started to be. You put alot of words in my mouth, I don't appreciate that. I'm sure you are a good full time firefighter, and you would probably make a good addition to the team. You just don't keep on track well (and yer spelling could use some werk).

[Firefighter1680]

lmao... ok then

[ABFF37]

wow...contentious issue...;)

AB

[Firefighter1680]

lol no kidding...............

[Wulfey]

There we go! See all I wanted was to make you laugh. My job here is done! Cool.

[Firefighter1680]

laughing at you not with you...lol

[iamvff]

I have been to fire college, and they are experts, yet no one has done any of what they teach as a profession. All book knowledge,
Hi FF1680,
I think that you had better do a bit of homework on this statement. I know quite afew of the instructors at the MESC, and I do know for a fact that some of them were many years on volunteer dept's, but I have never asked some of the others. Thus some do have actual experience, along with their book knowlege! Furthermore, When I did my level 1 practical evaluation...2 out of the 3 evaluators were from the Winnipeg fire service, seems as though those fella's got along with the OFC just fine!! Are you saying that Volunteer experience isn't the same?? Now we will have to move this thread to another post section, which if I remember correctly has been close by the BOSS! What a vicious circle!! :rolleyes: :p




iamvff

[Wulfey]

laughing at you not with you...lol
And I was being sarcastic. Is that the best you have? Sheesh.

[Firefighter1680]

You know me better than that iamvff...

[iamvff]

Yeah, I know...but I was feelin a little fiessty, and thought I would stir the pot a bit!! I haven't coaght hell in a while, and thought maybe I was loosin it!!

iamvff :D

[dentedhead]

Yeah, I know...but I was feelin a little fiessty, and thought I would stir the pot a bit!! I haven't coaght hell in a while, and thought maybe I was loosin it!!

iamvff :D


I dont think we are allowed to throw hell anymore therefore you cant catch it.Any time there has been a "heated" debate lately someone puts a padlock on it.Usually just when the flames are getting higher.Well I guess that makes sense being a FF site and allLOL.

Dentedhead
P.S this one has potential

[Firefighter1680]

Yes that it does Dent!!! Not worth it though..

[tmehmel]

Saw the usar truck tucked away at the college on saturday. It looked sad like nobody wanted to play with it, lol. And it was all white too, looked sharp!!!

Tom

[iamvff]

Saw the usar truck tucked away at the college on saturday. It looked sad like nobody wanted to play with it, lol. And it was all white too, looked sharp!!!

Tom

hey Tom,
Tried to look you up last weekend on my way through, couldn't figure out your last name in the phone book though, and no one around the gas station seemed to know anyone on the dept :rolleyes: . What were you up to at the college?? We are doing level 2 structural collapse at the end of the month, so that truck won't be very lonely for long!! :D PM me your phone number and I will try to call you on the way through this coming weekend. I am back in West St. Paul doing the testing for my level 1 instructors :eek:

iamvff

[iamvff]

Well, heard through the grape vine the other day that the Calgary exercise may be called off, yet again!! :mad: Guess we'll have to wait and see! AB...you might have to put that pint back in the fridge for a bit!!

On the bright side, level 2 structural collapse is on next week! COOL..we get to cut, bust, lift & break things!! I am most looking forward to the oxy/gasoline cutting torch...this tool is bazarre!! Can cut through 12 inches of steel like butter!

iamvff

[tmehmel]

well have fun, and be safe!!! Good luck on your exam

tom

[ABFF37]

Well, heard through the grape vine the other day that the Calgary exercise may be called off, yet again!! :mad: Guess we'll have to wait and see! AB...you might have to put that pint back in the fridge for a bit!!

On the bright side, level 2 structural collapse is on next week! COOL..we get to cut, bust, lift & break things!! I am most looking forward to the oxy/gasoline cutting torch...this tool is bazarre!! Can cut through 12 inches of steel like butter!

iamvff

No worries IAMVFF...there's always plenty of pints in my fridge :D...and hey, have fun cutting, busting, lifting and breaking things...sounds like my kind of course ;)

AB

[Wulfey]

Just got the e-mail, funding problems for the Calgary USAR exercise in October. Exercise cancelled. Too bad, I was looking forward to the trip. The Structural collapse II should be fun though. See ya there iamvff!

[iamvff]

You betcha!! Should be a hoot! I am probably not coming in until tuesday morning, see you there!

iamvff :)

[PEMS17]

Understand the MB USAR just had a training erecise at the old barn in the Peg. How did it go? Anybody got inside info on joining. Word is they need medics.

[Firefighter1680]

YEAH WAS GREAT!!! I enjoyed standy bye for 8 hours!! for the guys lol.. free donuts though... !!! woohoo.. :) Im not complaining im paid to be firefighter, any day is a good day!!

[iamvff]

Understand the MB USAR just had a training erecise at the old barn in the Peg. How did it go? Anybody got inside info on joining. Word is they need medics.
Unfortunately, I had to opt out of this exercise, as it was my final weekend of H/M Ops. But from the bit I heard about it. things went well. We will be hopefully :rolleyes: heading to the Calgary exercise in March. I think this one might actually go ahead. I will know on Monday or Tuesday if I am in on the Calgary trip.

iamvff

[ABFF37]

I will know on Monday or Tuesday if I am in on the Calgary trip.

iamvff

Well just make sure that you let me know what type of beer that I need to put on ice by Monday...come Tuesday I'll be out of the country for two weeks LOL :D

AB;)

[iamvff]

Well just make sure that you let me know what type of beer that I need to put on ice by Monday...come Tuesday I'll be out of the country for two weeks LOL :D

AB;)

Heeellloooooo.....LUCKY BEER!!!!! And I thought you new me by now!!

iamvff

[ABFF37]

Heeellloooooo.....LUCKY BEER!!!!! And I thought you new me by now!!

iamvff

LOL...I have seen the Lucky beer thing a few times in a few threads, I was just hoping that it was a bad dream...oh well to each his own :p It'll be cold when you get here!!!

AB:D

[firemedic8473]

It was a great exercise. There were people from other USAR task forces there watching us. Got alittle cold at night if you stopped moving around. Felt a little sad seeing the old barn come down, but it was a great place for the exercise.

[PEMS17]

Yeah I parked the unit in the Chapter's lot across the street and wandered over to find my old section from Maroon's Road. Hell of a landmark and craphole all in one. HORRIBLE sound and sightlines

[iamvff]

Just got the e-mail today, Calgary's back on....again, and I am in....again! Hopefully this one will pan out! AB...it's looking like coffee at best, you'll have to save the beer for another day. Maybe we will fit in a round of golf at the same time as the beer. Bring quarters! ;)

iamvff

[ABFF37]

Hey sounds like a plan iamvff! I look forward to it. But hey, if we're gonna play for money let's make it interesting...loonies? LOL :p

AB:)

[firemedic8473]

Hey iamvff, are you a lucky one who gets to drive to Calgary? Thats going to be a long trip.

[iamvff]

Hey iamvff, are you a lucky one who gets to drive to Calgary? Thats going to be a long trip.
Yup...thats OK, I like the drive! It'll be through the night so I can snooze! Are you going?

Besides...going through the GAP at least at night you can look at the stars! :D

iamvff

[firemedic8473]

Yep, Im going on a plane though. Im really looking forward to it. We'll have to work our butts off but it should be well worth it.

[iamvff]

Yep, Im going on a plane though. Im really looking forward to it. We'll have to work our butts off but it should be well worth it.

Whats your initials, so I can check your name on my list of important people? or a first name would help even more! :D

iamvff

[PEMS17]

Besides...going through the GAP at least at night you can look at the stars! :D

iamvff
What are the two best things to come out of the Gap??????

Highways #1 East and #1 West.

[firemedic8473]

Hey, iamvff the name is Dennis.

[iamvff]

Hey, iamvff the name is Dennis.
Sorry...DF or DM?? I am from melita, that will help you out if you have the list! Look forward to meeting you there!

iamvff

[Wulfey]

Winnipeg USAR exercise was great! You would have had a good time IAMVFF. Little chilly, good to see where our strengths and weaknesses are. Nice to see the boys out from WFPS! Hats off to you gentlemen for being on standby for us. What did you think of it 1680? Is USAR the kind of stuff your department does every day?
The admins argument is that we do this everyday so they should give the team to winnipeg to run and co-ordinate. I agree in that regard...

Calgary should be a good time! Heck of a drive for some of you boys. I have to put up with firemedic on the airplane though! Hey firemedic, will they let the stripper... I mean your cousin on the plane? Can't wait to go! We'll see you there IAMVFF.

[iamvff]

Yup, see ya there feller's!

iamvff :)

[firemedic8473]

you love to stur that pot dont you wulfey,lol

[Wulfey]

you love to stur that pot dont you wulfey,lol

It's quality entertainment! I find it funny when some of the most sarcastic people in the world can't take a joke. (see this thread, about page 6ish) Anyhow, does anyone know how the Calgary exercise is going? Is it kinda competition oriented, or will there be some sort of multi-jurisdiction unified command? Hey ABFF, are you going to be there?

[iamvff]

Ab's down in the sun right now, but I am sure he won't mind me answering for him...No, he is not on the Calgary team, but he probably will stick his nose in the door for a peek I would imagine.

iamvff

[iamvff]

OK..knock on wood...we are one evening away from the 3 or 4th try at the Calgary exercise and it hasn't been called off yet! :cool: Head out tomorrow nite, and will be back on Monday AM. Hopefully will be able to post some pic's when I return.

Hey AB, keep your phone handy and your beer cold...just in case I can figure out a way to go AWOL for a bit! Last I talked to Bestcoast he thought his trip to Cow Town was off, so I doubt I will be meeting him this weekend. I'll do my best to call you at the least though!

FM8473 looking forward to meeting you, wulfey looking forward to saying hi...again! See you all there!

iamvff ;) :)

[mutts252]

well, i found something that might just clear up all the fuzziness surround what constitutes a "heavy" USAR team, "medium", etc etc etc.

http://www.toronto.ca/wes/techservices/oem/husar/classification.htm

that will give you all the details for the various levels and abilities. the guidelines seem to be pretty tight...

[iamvff]

I see they finally got the Manitoba USAR Web Page up and running.

Here is the link for those who give a crap!! :)

http://www.firecomm.gov.mb.ca/usar_intro.html

and a team pic as well (I am front row, third from your left)

[tmehmel]

Looking good!! Good to see they finally got the page up. Keep up the good work there!

Tom

[iamvff]

BUMP....

anyone in for the Provincial exercise in December? It was supposed to be in Saskatoon, but has now been changed to somewhere in MB.

iamvff

[bestcoast]

VANCOUVER/CKNW(AM980) - Urban emergency teams need Federal funding. So says Vancouver's Search and Rescue Team as a Senate Committee looks into Canada's emergency preparedness.
Funding is key. That from Vancouver's Urban Search and Rescue Team as the Senate Committee on National Security and Defence studies Canada's emergency preparedness.
Spokesperson Brian Inglis says similar teams are being developed in Calgary, Manitoba, Toronto and Halifax, "We want to ensure that, not only is our training consistent, but our equipment cache and our ability to respond. We do have difficulty maintaining this team on our small budget. We need the Federal funds, to be quite honest with you."
Inglis says Vancover spends over half a million dollars a year to maintain the team. Vancouver's Urban Search and Rescue Team was among the first emergency groups to go to New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina. Inglis adds the trip wouldn't have been possible without Provincial funding

[ddfdriver]

Here in Ontario there is OSARVA (Ontario Search and Rescue Volunteer Assocition) There are many groups linked to this group from London to Sudbury and every where in the middle! The OPP are one of the trainers for this. I had had weeks of training with OPP and many other police groups! even a course on tracking from New York state police! there are many sar teams not just Urban!! If any one is looking for more info Google "OSARVA" There are many links to info! or any other Questions email my speter@ody.ca and i have lots of info on had here!

[iamvff]

Here in Ontario there is OSARVA (Ontario Search and Rescue Volunteer Association) There are many groups linked to this group from London to Sudbury and every where in the middle! The OPP are one of the trainers for this. I have had weeks of training with OPP and many other police groups! even a course on tracking from New York state police! there are many sar teams not just Urban!! If any one is looking for more info Google "OSARVA" There are many links to info! or any other Questions email my speter@ody.ca and i have lots of info on had here!
There is a difference between USAR and GSAR. In USAR we specialize in building collapse rescue. In GSAR we search for people who are lost. Both of the teams in Manitoba are mainly volunteer based and headed up by the office of the Fire Comissioner

iamvff