Promotion in volunteer dept.

[Hamp42]

I was wondering if anyone had any info they would be willing to share on their promotion criteria used within their departments (namely volunteer departments).
What do you use and how do you determine who gets promoted? Such as firefighter to officer, junior officer to senior officer.
You can post it here or send me a private message. Thanks.

[LTPVFD]

The method that we use combines a number of criteria.

Depending on the position, ie: Lieutenant or Captain, a number of prerequisites are required, ie: years of service, courses completed, etc. I am going from memory, but can look up the whole list if it will help you.

If you meet the prequisites, you are invited to apply. When I went through the promotion process, the following steps were required:

1. submit a resume

2. write an exam

3. do a 20 minute teaching presentation on assigned topic

4. do a table top command exercise

5. final oral interview

Each part of the process was scored. At the end of the process, the applicant with the highest score was the successful candidate. I felt this to be a fair process for all involved.

I have been in a volly department where officer positions were filled through an annual election. The senior positions, ie: Chief, Deputy Chief and Assistant Chief were held by longer serving members.

The Captains and Lieutenants, were, at times, more a popularity contest than a selection of the best qualified person.

Hope this information is of assistance to you. Let me know if there is any other information you need.

Stay safe !!


LTPVFD

[DFCSmash]

I'm not convinced this is the best system, but this is the way it is here.

Chief: Appointed by Councils on recommendation of Fire Board Usually Deputy moving up.

Deputy: Appointed by Chief, ratified by Council on recommendation of Fire Board.

Asst. Deputy: Appointed by Chief and Deputy

Captains: Suitable candidates approached by Senior officers, based on leadership ability, credentials, ability, seniority. Seniority is the least important. Leadership ability is the most important. Who will listen to someone they don't trust or respect? Further to that, just because you've got a dozen certificates doesn't mean you are a leader, any more than 20 years of service does. Two qualified from the above criteria will stand for election by the membership as a whole. Three if there are two positions open.

Our officers have always risen through the ranks. So far we have done well. Like I have said before here, I hope that I am carrying on their vision. Only time will tell.

[Toxic]

I can't speak for the department I'm on now. Still too new to the system. But on my old department...

Every year at a meeting involving all members captain and deputy chief candidates are nominated and have the option to accept or decline. Then it goes to a vote. Unless someone retires the guys who have been doing it usually get reappointed. Exception to this is their new deputy chief - I think the old deputy wanted out of the job anyways.

As for the Fire chief... he has been there forever and no one really wants the job. He is stuck and cannot retire.:D When he has had enough I'm sure his position will be replaced with the traditional voting system.

I personally liked this system - although I know it would not work in all halls.

[iamvff]

We are similar to DFC, for the most part it is just by moving up the ladder, seniority. Popularity definately can play a role in it, if you are not careful! The system hasn't failed to far yet, but you have to keep an eye on it also. We just talked to one of our Captains a couple of months ago, and told him he would either have to upgrade his training and improve his attendance, or step down to a firefighter position. He chose the latter. He has not taken any training in over 5 years, comes to about 3 meetings/4 fires per year, and the guys were not comfortable under his command. Could have been ugly, but fortunately, all went smooth.

BE SAFE
IAMVFF

[ndvfd_ff33]

Toxic...Your dept and mine sound almost the exact same...Chief whose days on earth are limited down to hours rather than days,weeks or months...But we have basically the exact same deal...Chief is nominated by members of the dept...Then he chooses his other officers...Those chosen have the right to decline the posistion etc etc..

[WFD999]

In our little world. Our SOP'S set it up as

1- trianing courses for the position complete

2- 80 % of all general and trianing meeting attended in previous year

3- nominated by the senior officers

4- Put to a vote by all members at a general meeting.

5- Subject to review after 3 months of service by entire officer group.

Hope this helps

[arrow]

The only way to get promoted at my former dept was to heavily brown nose the paid staff-we had 25 volunteers and 3 daytime paid staff-volunteers had NO say in who got elected to be an officer. Our paid guys even elected a rookie to be a captain!(9 months on the dept with NO command courses or related experience)

[dave5171]

I'm still a little new at this department to know better but I believe it like this. To become a officer first you have to quaify for T/F (Training Falistator) which is a 20 hour course then you have to teach a basic course after that you have to write a essay. Once thats all complete you get up graded to Acting Officer. Once in that position you have to wait till a opening happens then your invited to apply. I'm sure then there is a vote and then your on.
Like I said I know I'm pretty close to how this works but I could be wrong. I'll ask next fire practice.

[sookeff]

Well, apparently in the North Thompson Valley, it's based on popularity, as opposed to experience and accreditation. Bitterly disappointed to have been passed over for a red hat tonight to a member with 2 years experience, over my 4. Do I really want to put my life into those hands? Not really. Kinda bummed here, but what can you do? I hope he lives up to all expectations, and I wish him all the best.

[dentedhead]

Well, apparently in the North Thompson Valley, it's based on popularity, as opposed to experience and accreditation. Bitterly disappointed to have been passed over for a red hat tonight to a member with 2 years experience, over my 4. Do I really want to put my life into those hands? Not really. Kinda bummed here, but what can you do? I hope he lives up to all expectations, and I wish him all the best.


I would have concerns in putting my trust in a 4 yr man as my capt period. A two year man? I am that man. At this point in my career,I couldnt organize a pissup if the fireground was a brewery.

In most FT depts (I know its VFD promotions thread) you are just completing your 1st class rank at 4 years,I know I wouldnt be ready to be a capt at that point.regardless of my practical and/or theoretical qualifications.

This is not a slight or insult aimed at anyone only an observation and personal opinion.

Dentedhead




Dentedhead

[Whitewater_419]

I would have concerns in putting my trust in a 4 yr man as my capt period. A two year man? I am that man. At this point in my career,I couldnt organize a pissup if the fireground was a brewery.

In most FT depts (I know its VFD promotions thread) you are just completing your 1st class rank at 4 years,I know I wouldnt be ready to be a capt at that point.regardless of my practical and/or theoretical qualifications.

This is not a slight or insult aimed at anyone only an observation and personal opinion.


I'd have to question that one, too; I'm two years on a paid on-call department and as much as I'd like to wear the red hat one day, this isn't the day/year to do it. There's still far, far too much to learn - much of that which comes from the captains, for me to even imagine being in that position.

From what I understand, getting the rank of captain in our dept pretty much involves seniority, but you've gotta be approved by the chief and DC, first. Fortunately for us, we've got a really _good_ chief and DC, so I can't see any questionable promotions like that happening around here.

[DFCSmash]

Question. Two years total experience? Or two years in your hall with 6 or more elsewhere? Let's not forget vollies move around too.

You wouldn't be on the consideration list here with less than double digits. Oh, and lets not forget intelligence. A fine quality in an officer.

A two year member is just about ready to run the pump at a working fire. Captain?

But then again I don't know the details, so I shouldn't comment.

[wilderness]

[QUOTE=Whitewater_419]I'd have to question that one, too; I'm two years on a paid on-call department and as much as I'd like to wear the red hat one day, this isn't the day/year to do it. There's still far, far too much to learn - much of that which comes from the captains, for me to even imagine being in that position.

From what I understand, getting the rank of captain in our dept pretty much involves seniority, but you've gotta be approved by the chief and DC, first. Fortunately for us, we've got a really _good_ chief and DC, so I can't see any questionable promotions like that happening around here.[/QUOTE
MY GOD MAN....you don't need to start sucking up so early, what a brown noser........15 days of freedom..better enjoy it while you can

[Whitewater_419]

MY GOD MAN....you don't need to start sucking up so early, what a brown noser........15 days of freedom..better enjoy it while you can

ROFL!!!

_YOU_ know our chief and DC - Do you think sucking up to either of them would have any effect other than to get ya permanently assigned to traffic duty and Septic System search and rescue ? :) :) :)

Besides, I still think _you_ should buck for captain };-)>

[engine61enroute]

1 - Must meet min. requirments in training.

2 - Must meet min. years in dept.

3 - Then a posting will go up and give the perspective canidates a chance to think about the role.

4 - Then those intrested aply in writing to the Current officers
5 - We may choose to form a committee to assist.

6 - Then a short list is formed and then each memeber gets interviewed for the selected position(s)

7 - Then each officer is in for a term set out in the OG's

8 - When the term is up then the officers and membership will vote on if that officer will continue for another term. If there is a "no" vote or if at anytime an officer wishes to step down then that position will be posted again and the selection process will begin. IF its yes then that officer will continue for the next term.

Terms - Chief & D/C - 5 years
Capts - 4 years
Lt's 3 years

We use to do the vote, and it was Ok but when I became chief this year I wanted to make sure that the officers I work with can do the job. In past when I was D/C I had officers who wernt well suited for the role and just liked the power ---those guys wont last now! But this year is going to be the first year that we will try it and so far the crew of 30 is happy about it.

Medical coordinators are appoined
Safety committee memebrs are appointed
Association chair is elected by memebership.

Hope this helps
Nick

[MFDFF33]

For us in order to get a promotion, you have to attend a certain amount of meetings (for us each monday night we do training) plus attend a certain amount of training courses. Then you have to apply for the position through a written application, then the Chief and DC's decide.

[Buckster]

Our Chief is designated by the municipality, after the dept makes their reccomendation. Chief then designates all his officers. Every January we have a vote of confidence in all our officers. That said, if there is a problem with an officer at any time, a group of 5 or more members can request a special meeting.