For those who have done the tkt and acp test!

[stingr]

Which test did you find more difficult the Knowledge threshold exam in Calgary or the EMR certification with the ACP?

[18atone]

Never done the TKT. However I have a question, if you are in class 1-2006 with the CFD. How many in that class failed the TKT? It will be difficult to convince the floor about 1001 training being a good thing if almost half a class fails the first test within the department.

[Scuba]

Is this the first class through that all had their 1001 prior to the recruitment?



Never done the TKT. However I have a question, if you are in class 1-2006 with the CFD. How many in that class failed the TKT? It will be difficult to convince the floor about 1001 training being a good thing if almost half a class fails the first test within the department.

[stingr]

I've heard that a couple failed the physical and a few more failed the the knowledge threshold. I'm in the second class.

[ABFF37]

Is this the first class through that all had their 1001 prior to the recruitment?

It's the second one, there was one that was run early last year, I think the members of that class are pretty close to being done their probationary year.

It's a sketchy subject in some regards, they are given less training time with each unit in recruit school because the expectation is that they already have a certain level of skills in place with their 1001. The criticism is, is it a good idea to skimp on training for our new guys? True they have the 1001's but some of the skills like SCBA and search and rescue are our bread and butter, so the more the merrier. And as 18atone said, I've heard that several candidates failed the threshold knowledge exam and lost their job offers.

I hate to be rude here, but the TKT is a straight forward exam if you've studied the materials that are given to you. If you already have 1001 training, then get your TKT books, study guide, and six weeks to study everything, and then you fail the exam? That's a problem, and I don't really feel that bad if someone gets weeded out because of that, just as I don't feel bad when I hear about people failing other critical elements of the recruit process that are directly related to the job itself, say the CPAT for example.

I will sympathise with people (in any recruit process) who are frustrated with irrelevant apptitude exams, or problems with things like the polygraph, or anything that isn't directly related to firefighting...you know, the weird HR approved stuff that leaves you scratching your head. But if you fail a knowledge test or a physical test that you have had more than ample time to prepare for, you deserve to be removed from the process so that another candidate who can deliver the goods gets the spot. I, along with all of my fellow firefighters on the job depend on our new recruits having the knowledge, skills, fittness and strength to get the job done, and to look out for me as I look out for them. If they can't do it, maybe they will be able to at some point, but right now they aren't ready for it. As a firefighter who has gone through all of these hoops, why would I or any of my coworkers want to settle for someone who couldn't?
Appologies if that sounds harsh, it's just the reality of a job that is mentally and physically demanding.

AB

[stingr]

It's the second one, there was one that was run early last year, I think the members of that class are pretty close to being done their probationary year.

It's a sketchy subject in some regards, they are given less training time with each unit in recruit school because the expectation is that they already have a certain level of skills in place with their 1001. The criticism is, is it a good idea to skimp on training for our new guys? True they have the 1001's but some of the skills like SCBA and search and rescue are our bread and butter, so the more the merrier. And as 18atone said, I've heard that several candidates failed the threshold knowledge exam and lost their job offers.

I hate to be rude here, but the TKT is a straight forward exam if you've studied the materials that are given to you. If you already have 1001 training, then get your TKT books, study guide, and six weeks to study everything, and then you fail the exam? That's a problem, and I don't really feel that bad if someone gets weeded out because of that, just as I don't feel bad when I hear about people failing other critical elements of the recruit process that are directly related to the job itself, say the CPAT for example.

I will sympathise with people (in any recruit process) who are frustrated with irrelevant apptitude exams, or problems with things like the polygraph, or anything that isn't directly related to firefighting...you know, the weird HR approved stuff that leaves you scratching your head. But if you fail a knowledge test or a physical test that you have had more than ample time to prepare for, you deserve to be removed from the process so that another candidate who can deliver the goods gets the spot. I, along with all of my fellow firefighters on the job depend on our new recruits having the knowledge, skills, fittness and strength to get the job done, and to look out for me as I look out for them. If they can't do it, maybe they will be able to at some point, but right now they aren't ready for it. As a firefighter who has gone through all of these hoops, why would I or any of my coworkers want to settle for someone who couldn't?
Appologies if that sounds harsh, it's just the reality of a job that is mentally and physically demanding.

AB

I tend to agree with you! That's why I'm going to be ready. I feel like I could probably write the threshold exam already, and I've got 3 weeks left until I write. I've been studying I'd say on an average 3-5 hrs per day since I got my material. I don't want to fail.

[iamvff]

I tend to agree with you! That's why I'm going to be ready. I feel like I could probably write the threshold exam already, and I've got 3 weeks left until I write. I've been studying I'd say on an average 3-5 hrs per day since I got my material. I don't want to fail.
Keep that attitude up...and you will not only pass, you will achieve yuour goals of fulltime!

iamvff

[DoubleHelix]

I don't see why instead of aptitude tests they don't do NFPA tests.

If most cities are going the fire education mandatory anyways why not?

[ABFF37]

I tend to agree with you! That's why I'm going to be ready. I feel like I could probably write the threshold exam already, and I've got 3 weeks left until I write. I've been studying I'd say on an average 3-5 hrs per day since I got my material. I don't want to fail.

Iamvff nailed it there, you have the right attitude to succeed. It's a lot of work, and it takes a lot of time to get through all the study materials, but it's all worth it in the end. All the best with the studying, and good luck on the test! If you need any advice or have any questions, post em' or PM me and I will do my best ;)

AB

[18atone]

I was uncertain about all the different testing for recruitment processes as well. Got out of my comfort zone and found out where and why, long trip but an interesting one.

Most HR functions developed over time because of arbitrary type standards which ruled the workplace in the past. Now pre-employment testing in any form must have defendable and reasonable grounds for the test or it could be challenged. Interesting that something which is in place, for fairness and consistency, is then so hated by the people for which such rules are developed to protect.

Other testing (such as polygraph) may seem not related to FFing however any company still has the right to set certain criteria for the people they feel fit their workplace. Get over it people, they set the rules for which you must comply or look elsewhere for work. How well would your company run if you had to hire just anyone for every or any position. Screen carefully now because once you own that problem you have them for life in most cases in the union environment.

To answer Doublehelix's question: you can't use NFPA tests in the place of aptitude tests because everyone must have a fair chance in an aptitude test. Aptitude tests gauges your general abilities to do a job so must not be something you can train or study too much for. Yes many FD's are requiring a 1001 standard pre-employment and at that point you could argue for the NFPA test. However this would be a real step back in most hiring processes, making the door smaller. Not the idea for most job searchers.

IMHO being able to purchase a course or certificate does not necessary supply you with an education or the aptitude for a profession. Daddy's money will not make a clown able to play nice and rule the playground.

Commitment to a way of life; learning and striving, bending not breaking are the metal of a good FF, stuff which is not really forged in a classroom. A classroom certainly can help but the heat comes from somewhere else.

Be safe out there.

[DoubleHelix]

I was uncertain about all the different testing for recruitment processes as well. Got out of my comfort zone and found out where and why, long trip but an interesting one.

Most HR functions developed over time because of arbitrary type standards which ruled the workplace in the past. Now pre-employment testing in any form must have defendable and reasonable grounds for the test or it could be challenged. Interesting that something which is in place, for fairness and consistency, is then so hated by the people for which such rules are developed to protect.

Other testing (such as polygraph) may seem not related to FFing however any company still has the right to set certain criteria for the people they feel fit their workplace. Get over it people, they set the rules for which you must comply or look elsewhere for work. How well would your company run if you had to hire just anyone for every or any position. Screen carefully now because once you own that problem you have them for life in most cases in the union environment.

To answer Doublehelix's question: you can't use NFPA tests in the place of aptitude tests because everyone must have a fair chance in an aptitude test. Aptitude tests gauges your general abilities to do a job so must not be something you can train or study too much for. Yes many FD's are requiring a 1001 standard pre-employment and at that point you could argue for the NFPA test. However this would be a real step back in most hiring processes, making the door smaller. Not the idea for most job searchers.

IMHO being able to purchase a course or certificate does not necessary supply you with an education or the aptitude for a profession. Daddy's money will not make a clown able to play nice and rule the playground.

Commitment to a way of life; learning and striving, bending not breaking are the metal of a good FF, stuff which is not really forged in a classroom. A classroom certainly can help but the heat comes from somewhere else.

Be safe out there.



Never thought of it that way. Thanks for clearing it up.