#1  
Old 06-17-2016, 07:44 PM
w_mean w_mean is offline
 
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Default Questions on PPE and SOG's

Hey guys,

I'm doing research regarding some issues that have risen up at a local volunteer hall. I've scoured the internet and found some answers, but I figured I'd go straight to the source and see how things are done across the country with regards to PPE and SOG's. Here are my questions:

1. What's your department's rules for PPE mandatory retirement? NFPA 1851 specifies 10 years for all structural and proximity gear.

2. Does your unit do annual advanced inspections of PPE [ie hot service test]? Do they send it out, or is it done on location by someone at the department?

3. In your SOG's, do you guys have strict lines of communication guidelines? Are you allowed to speak about departmental issues outside of your department? For example, approach a member of the local government about issues [such as PPE not being up to standards, etc.]?

4. Do your SOG's cover suspensions, and termination? What is the procedure for each - if any - in terms of recourse.

Thanks kindly!
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  #2  
Old 09-21-2016, 06:23 PM
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Roree403 Roree403 is offline
 
Location: Central Ontario
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1. never a bad idea to follow NFPA

2. sent out to be annual tested

3. one of the quickest ways to find yourself terminated in our department, there is a clearly outlined chain of command and it is expected to be followed.

4. certainly do, while it is a lengthy document the basic outline is

verbal warning (documented)
written warning
suspension
termination

This essentially applies to performing a similar act of contravention in a 2 year period. Something serious such as theft or violence etc. will result in immediate termination if found guilty or charged.
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Old 09-23-2016, 02:23 PM
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hmckay91 hmckay91 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by w_mean View Post
What's your department's rules for PPE mandatory retirement? NFPA 1851 specifies 10 years for all structural and proximity gear.
NFPA provides standards nominally based on best practices. NFPA standards are consensus standards and occasionally reflect differing opinions. Most of the standards are only legally enforceable under enabling legislation (e.g. NFPA 10 and NFPA 13 under most Canadian Building and Fire Codes)

To answer the original question we retire gear from front line service when it fails the 1851 tests or at 10 years, which ever is sooner. Once it retires it can be issued for non-live fire training (generally recruit training) until it is deemed worn out, when it is disposed of.

As a side note departments need to do the math. They may find themselves replacing that $1500 gear they got a deal on every 6 years, where the $2500 gear lasts the full 10.

Quote:
Originally Posted by w_mean View Post
2. Does your unit do annual advanced inspections of PPE [ie hot service test]? Do they send it out, or is it done on location by someone at the department?
We do basic inspections and cleaning in-house and send out for advanced cleaning/decon and repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by w_mean View Post
3. In your SOG's, do you guys have strict lines of communication guidelines? Are you allowed to speak about departmental issues outside of your department? For example, approach a member of the local government about issues [such as PPE not being up to standards, etc.]?
Strict, No. Reasonable Yes. In a properly run municipal system firefighters work for the FD who work for the CAO and the CAO works for council. Council should not be involved (or interfere) in day to day municipal operations.

Anyone going outside the traditional management loop are throwing the FD management team and the CAO under the bus. The first question a competent councillor would ask is what the hell is this member doing? Sometimes, indiscrete counselors may even inadvertently raise these questions in open council which may bring heat and light to the contentious issue (as well as the raiser), at the expense of CAO and FD credibility. Regardless if undermining the management team is the goal or not it is not a path to long term employment.

Someone may try to play the "I'm just a citizen" card to "get around" the however that often does not wash as the issue(s) require an in-depth knowledge of the situation that the "average" ratepayer would not have.

Quote:
Originally Posted by w_mean View Post
4. Do your SOG's cover suspensions, and termination? What is the procedure for each - if any - in terms of recourse.
Roree403 pretty much mentions the principles of progressive discipline that most departments abide by. For a transgression as outlined above in Question 3, and relative to the ensuing s@#$ storm, the standard progressive discipline may be skipped and moved straight to termination/dismissal with or without cause.

I don't know of any department that would want its dirty laundry aired in public.

A relatively recent and case similar to the OP... (as always there is more to the story than the media presents)

http://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/bonnyvill...rsens-1.592615
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  #4  
Old 12-17-2016, 05:27 PM
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LTES40 LTES40 is offline
 
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Default Ppe

As far as PPE goes our department is on top of it. We spend our first training night in the new year going over our PPE. We strip everything apart and inspect it for wear, rips. The department is good at replacing old outdated equipment. If someone is no longer on the department due to retirement, termination/quitting. One of the 4 full time staff pull the gear off of the rack, same with time outs/suspensions. And if after any call or training we have any issue with our gear we send our HQ a message and they get it fixed that goes the same for cleaning.
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